"Laughter Makes We Realize That We Have So Many Things in Common," with Stefano Iaboni, on the Power of Laughter and Joy, Team Bonding, Creativity, and Cultural Interconnectedness.

Zhou Fang: [00:00:00] All right. Uh, hello everyone. Welcome to the Intersection, uh, a podcast program about intersectionality and the stories that come with it. And behind every story, we have a human being, um, at least for now. Um, and it's a, it's a really good. Time to have this conversation because I feel, um, a lot of us have been feeling a lot of, uh, pressure or, um, mixed feelings about the world we're in these days.

And in my opinion, what we need more is, uh, less anxiety. And more joy and more laughter, um, and more just kind of like friendly conversations, right? Just hanging out, et cetera. So, um, just thinking about that makes me happy and also thrilled [00:01:00] to introduce my guest today to you all. His name is Stefano Ani, and we met through a mutual friend last year.

And, uh, Stefano is the founder and principal practitioner at Smile Solution. So, as you can tell, SMILE is what Stefano does, is to bring smile and joy, uh, to communities and at workplace. And what I really remember from my, uh, conversations and chats with Stefano is the, the commonality and the similarities we found from each other's heritage.

So I'm Chinese. Stefano is Italian. So we talked about our own culture and our own customs, and we found out that we actually have a lot of similarities, which is so joyful and fun. Um, so I'm going to pass the mic to Stefano and please [00:02:00] introduce yourself.

Stefano Iaboni: Hi everybody. Thank you so much for this opportunity. I'm so happy to be here, you know, chatting about stuff with you folks. Uh, so yeah, I'm Stefano. I am from Italy. I moved there in the United States into 2013. And uh, what I do, I help companies and businesses and people. Uh, turn stress into smiles and creativity into currency.

Oh, how do I do that? Uh, well, I do that through keynote presentation, through team building. Well, I like team bonding actually better than till building and, uh, through workshops and, you know, training and such. Why do I do this? Well, as you said, Joe, I believe we need more joy, more laughter, more humor, especially nowadays things are so heavy out there um, my background is in comedy, so I've been doing comedy 20 plus year of my life, which is also. [00:03:00] Interesting because generally speaking, when I, you tell people, I mean, this has been my experience when I tell people I do comedy, um, the, the fault, you know, people just go like, oh, you do standup? Oh, you tell jokes? I don't do that. No. Uh, when I do, it's more mainly nonverbal, which is interesting because now I became a speaker, right?

Zhou Fang: Right.

Stefano Iaboni: Speak. But when I do, I try to make people laugh. I do it without talking. Well, I do maybe a little bit of talking because, um, well, I want to clarify, you know, because then, then people say, oh, you are mine, right? No, no, I'm not a mine. I'm more somebody like, um, Mr. Bean. Right? I think everybody's kind of familiar with Mr.

Bean, Ron Atkinson. Um, I think that that type of humor, in my opinion, is very universal, right? Because we don't need the language. We don't need the, you know, background. You know, it doesn't matter, you know, where you come from. It doesn't matter. Your economical status. It doesn't matter your color, the skin, we all know to [00:04:00] speak the language of laughter, which different than the language of comedy.

Yes, they do go together, but I think, um, you know, comedy, maybe it's more personal, comedy is more, uh, cultural. Say, you know, as you were saying, you know, you're Chinese, I'm Italian. Maybe something that is funny for a Chinese person is not funny for an Italian person or the other way around. Right?

Zhou Fang: Totally, totally.

Stefano Iaboni: we all know how to laugh.

Ultimately, we know, know how to laugh. Um, you know, as a species, that's the first thing that we do. At three and a half months, you know, we, we, we laugh, we f it's interesting to me, we, we learn how to laugh before we learn how to speak, which makes laughter the most direct and simpler way of communication with the, between human beings, right?

Zhou Fang: Mm-hmm.

Stefano Iaboni: If I smile, if I laugh at somebody, well not laugh at them, but, you know, if I smile, you know. You probably gonna smile back, you know, that's generally speaking. Yeah.

Zhou Fang: Um, thank you for that and um, I'm very curious. I mean, I [00:05:00] feel as a consultant or practitioner, we all have different approach, right? Like for example, um, my approach is introducing intersectionality and then how people see how different and how similar we all are at the same time. So that we have an opportunity to bring people together and your approach is smile, and of course I understand that comes from your background in comedy, and I'm also like wonder what made you decide to make that career shift.

Not, not like a hundred percent pivot, but like, use your skillset, use what you know you do best,

Stefano Iaboni: Mm-hmm.

Zhou Fang: um, take that skillset into consulting. Like how did you make that decision

Stefano Iaboni: Yeah. Thank you for that question. I've actually. I like what you said about what you do because I think that as in a way beside our [00:06:00] culture, we have similarity. I think also

Zhou Fang: A lot.

Stefano Iaboni: that we do, uh, because I like that despite what you just said, right? Uh, we do have things in common, right? Many depends.

Different culture, different type of people. We know, we might not even aware of the fact that we have so much things in common.

Zhou Fang: Mm-hmm.

Stefano Iaboni: is one of those things that make you realize, oh, wait, we got so many things in common.

Zhou Fang: Mm-hmm.

Stefano Iaboni: So I, I'd say that, uh, through my life as a comedian, I also had experiences of working, um, in like, say difficult situation like, uh, with, you know, refugees or, or, you know, people that didn't have the same resources and, uh, that, you know, some other people might have. Um. And I, I, I, I, I realized that like, you know, laughter is very powerful. You know, laughter can bring people, people together instantly. It breaks down barrier, you know, and then while I was working, I was working, I with, uh, clowns Without Borders, uh, in 20. I went to Syria, right. And worked there, [00:07:00] Iraqi refugees, and also had the opportunity to work with the, um, people from the United Nation.

And we did workshops for people in United Nations that did involve laughter, humor and such. And it was, you know, it, it was incredible to me to see people that, generally speaking in. know, they might be, you know, work in a very serious environment, you know, or, or, uh, you know, drop the men, them to be very serious.

You know, how the things can change. You know, when they, when they laugh because they relax, they really like, they're just being authentic, you know, they're being themself, you know? So that made me realize. Oh wait, this thing is not just helpful for, you know, uh, performing arts or people in the arts. It's really helpful also for people in business, you know, because think because of that, because it creates authenticity, uh, because it makes you, I know you show up as you are, you know, if

Zhou Fang: Mm-hmm.

Stefano Iaboni: And if you allow yourself to have a sense of humor, then you really [00:08:00] like, uh, I don't know, you, things can change. They can, there can be a huge change. I witnessed this, you know, working with companies and, uh, people around the world, you know, that how things can change all the energy, you know, generally speaking, that's one of the main things.

The energy changes, right?

Zhou Fang: Mm-hmm.

Stefano Iaboni: allow yourself. Right? And sometimes I think that in business, um, there might be this, um, uh, misinterpretation, misunderstanding about. You know, we are doing business here, man. We, we don't laugh here. There's no time for that. You know, we're serious. We're making money. And I'm like, no, it's the other way around. It's actually, the more you are allowed there in your business, the more money you're gonna make. Because, because, well ultimately, I mean, one of the main thing is like, I personally like to do business with people that I enjoy being around. Right? If you have a sense of humor, if you smile, I wanna do. With you, you know, otherwise it's like, oh man, this is so boring. You know? There's, we are so many, there's so many people out there that I wanna hang out with. If you're like [00:09:00] stiff and you're just like, oh nah, I have no time. Sorry. Um, you

Zhou Fang: Hmm.

Stefano Iaboni: that's, I think one of the main thing. And also if you're a leader, if you're a, you know, somebody that.

A higher position in the, in the, in the business. If you allow that, if you are, if you're happy, if you're jolly, if you allow laughter, you basically, you become more approachable. You know, you become more human, you become approachable, and you cr can create that psychological, psychological safety for people within the company.

To be risk takers, right? So say, have this, you know, I'm, I work with this company and we are working on a project, everything and things are stuck and I might have an idea, in my mind that sounds ridiculous. If I work in an environment where there is laughter, where that is allowed, where that is okay, that I will share that idea, will I will be like, I'll be all right.

Sharing it, right?

Zhou Fang: Hmm.

Stefano Iaboni: would think, oh man, that's ridiculous. But actually, wait a minute. That actually might work. If I'm in a place where like, oh, everything's [00:10:00] so serious. Everything's so tight, nobody laughs, nobody smile. Mm. I don't know if I'll share that. You

Zhou Fang: Mm-hmm.

Stefano Iaboni: surprised, you know, that like something really ridiculous sometimes can be, uh, a solution to a real problem, you know? Um, another thing's interesting about laughter, it's somehow laughter can put, can combine two ideas that have no, that make no sense. Right.

Zhou Fang: Mm-hmm.

Stefano Iaboni: know, they can, you can put them together and actually laughter help them make sense. I dunno if I explain that right. But, you know, um, so yeah, the transition was kind of a natural thing, I guess, you know, I like. Uh, I don't know. I'm a, I like being with people. Well, I like being with people that I enjoy

Zhou Fang: Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm.

Stefano Iaboni: I'm a social person. my, you know, to me the greatest joy in life to make other people laugh is just the greatest thing. You

Zhou Fang: Mm.

Stefano Iaboni: It's like, I, I think because it creates that, don't know, experience that you are in present, you're in the moment, you're sharing something with [00:11:00] other people that you might not even know you.

I think laughter. And then I'm talking as a, you know, as a entertainer, what I've seen is this, they laughter it's their vehicle to create between people that don't know each other. Because in that moment, they're all be being present, they're all sharing the same thing, right? So we, we find, uh, uh, things that we have in common by maybe laughing at the same, you know, joke or whatever that is situation.

Then you discover, oh wait, I have. And maybe a similar sense of humor that the other person, these

Zhou Fang: Mm-hmm.

Stefano Iaboni: enjoys the same thing that I enjoy. Right.

Zhou Fang: Mm-hmm.

Stefano Iaboni: like, I think it's the beauty of creating an, an experience where everybody's together, you know, just being one in a way, right? You're like, just the being there.

You're watching somebody, you listen to somebody, whatever that is, that make you laugh. You're just being together. Right. Um, I

Zhou Fang: Mm-hmm.

Stefano Iaboni: it's, uh, yeah, I think it's a, it's a beautiful thing and I, and I love doing that. And it is not. It not about ego, it's just something that I like to do. You know, it's like, oh, it's a great thing to like [00:12:00] see other people laugh, I think.

And ultimately, especially, you know, considering what is happening in the world right now, I think it's just also I just a very good distraction. You know?

Zhou Fang: True.

Stefano Iaboni: you

Zhou Fang: I fully agree.

Stefano Iaboni: so it's like you're not thinking of what is happening out there, right. Oh, in this moment, whatever that is. I'm just laughing.

I'm having a good time. And

Zhou Fang: Mm-hmm.

Stefano Iaboni: then later, yes, I can worry about, you know, whatever. Whatever else. Yeah.

Zhou Fang: Yeah, I that I really resonate with my, um, my boyfriend and I, we send each other very funny, like animal short videos. They are, there's no meaning other than joy and just cute. They're cute, they're joyful. And sometimes, like you said, they're ridiculous. There absolutely no use of that information other than I get a laugh.

Um, and another thing you mentioned [00:13:00] that I really want to emphasize is, um. A lot of business people consider their work very serious, and I don't disagree. I think the work itself can be very serious, right? Like you have people's livelihood at stake. You need to pay people. If we lose money, then we have to lay off people, and that's a huge responsibility.

I understand the weight of some people's job or their business at the same time. Like you said, if all you do is serious work, then people don't, people can't bond with you. People cannot have that psychological safety

Stefano Iaboni: Mm-hmm.

Zhou Fang: you. And that reminds me of, um, have you read the book, uh, the Little Prince.

Stefano Iaboni: Oh yeah. Many years ago. Yes.

Zhou Fang: Yeah, I, I just remembered this little segment in the book.

It's not a big book, so if you are curious audience out there, check out the book. It's very, um, insightful and delightful. [00:14:00] Um. This little segment in the book when Little Prince is visiting one star or one planet, is this one place is occupied by a business person, and all this business person says is I'm a very serious man.

Stefano Iaboni: Hmm.

Zhou Fang: That's all he says. And then when Little Prince tries to have a conversation with him, all he can respond with is, I'm a serious person. Like that's all he does is business.

Stefano Iaboni: Hmm.

Zhou Fang: And Little Prince is like, this is a very weird place. And then he left.

Stefano Iaboni: I would've left the same. I mean, I would've gone to a different planet too, you know, if I happened to be the prince.

Zhou Fang: Yeah.

Stefano Iaboni: that I love, that actually makes me feel like I wanna read it again. Uh, I read it many, many years ago, right? Um, but I think thing is this, right? I say is serious, but we don't have to be. Okay,

Zhou Fang: Hmm.

Stefano Iaboni: that doesn't mean that I need to show up at work with like a, a [00:15:00] clown nose, right. A red nose. I mean, if you're into it, sure. But it is not that. Right. Or and it is not even the fact that, oh, I need to go and work and I need to become the, the office comedian. Right. I need to tell jokes all the time.

No, no, no. It's not that. It's really about, mainly, I think it's really change your mindset, you

Zhou Fang: Right.

Stefano Iaboni: and, and start looking at reality. a different way with different perspective. Right? Start looking at things around you. Pay attention. That's one of the main thing, right? We go fast, fast, fast. Like running, running, busy, busy, busy.

Working, working. Just sometimes it's good to pause and just pay attention and look at the things around you. That is comedy in everything, in my opinion. But we can find, you know, funny things everywhere, right? And

Zhou Fang: Mm-hmm.

Stefano Iaboni: it's just about. paying attention and, and look at the things that resonates with you, right?

Because ultimately we laugh at things that we can, um, connect to, you know, that, that are like, uh. Uh, we laugh at things that like, because we know that [00:16:00] experience, right? We have been through that experience, so I know. Oh, oh, that's funny because I had that feeling. I've been in that situation that that's what is funny, right? I mean, there are studies about, and you know, a lot of studies and things that says that most of the times people laugh. This is with comedy, right? They say that people a lot of time don't necessarily laugh about the joke itself, but they laugh about the sound of laughter. They laugh because other people are laughing, right?

Zhou Fang: Huh.

Stefano Iaboni: is contagious, right?

Zhou Fang: Right.

Stefano Iaboni: remember like in the nineties they had those, um, those television shows where they had those, the fake laughter in the background, right?

Zhou Fang: Yes. Like the clap.

Stefano Iaboni: Yeah, yeah, yeah. Or clap

Zhou Fang: Clap and laugh. Yeah.

Stefano Iaboni: So that would be basically, I think the. It would basically say, okay, now is the time to laugh.

So if you're watching, you know, if you hear that, oh, that means that, that's funny. Supposedly. Right. And also if I hear other people laughing, I might start laughing too. Right. That's, uh, interesting. So I think [00:17:00] it's, it's really that, it's really that just, you know, pay attention to the things that are around you.

And, and, and you

Zhou Fang: Hmm.

Stefano Iaboni: and through that you might discover things that you have in common with other people. You might laugh at the same thing. You might think that same, similar things are funny. Right? And, and there are a lot of things that happened that, um, say, you know. A situation. Maybe it's not funny in the moment, but it might be funny later.

Zhou Fang: Right.

Stefano Iaboni: right.

Zhou Fang: I have had so many of those.

Stefano Iaboni: You know what I mean? It's like

Zhou Fang: Yeah.

Stefano Iaboni: you know, something happens, you walk into a place and you, I don't know, you have. I dunno, a stain on your shirt or, or you fall or you, you do something silly or you have your shirt inside down, I don't know what, whatever that is, right?

Zhou Fang: Mm-hmm.

Stefano Iaboni: that moment

Zhou Fang: Mm-hmm.

Stefano Iaboni: might feel like, oh gosh, oh gosh, this is embarrassing.

Oh my

Zhou Fang: Mm-hmm.

Stefano Iaboni: it's in front of everybody. But then later when you tell the story to somebody else, we can all laugh about it,

Zhou Fang: Totally. [00:18:00] Yes.

Stefano Iaboni: wouldn't be great if we are able, I mean, this takes practice and, and it's a skill. Wouldn't be great if you're able to laugh it in the moment. You know what I mean? So if that happens, instead of seeing that as a mistake, instead of seeing that as like, oh gosh, first to me, it's like, it's an opportunity to, you know, oh, I learn out of this experience, right?

Because in my opinion, you just learn out of mistakes,

Zhou Fang: Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm.

Stefano Iaboni: how you, this is how you get better, right? And then it's like, oh, can I laugh at that while it's happening? Right? Because if I, you see, this is like, because my experience as an entertainer, you know, taught me this, right? If you. If something happened on stage right, and you are in front of a crowd and

Zhou Fang: Hmm.

Stefano Iaboni: say, quote, quote, unquote, a mistake, right?

Zhou Fang: Right,

Stefano Iaboni: supposed to happen.

Zhou Fang: right.

Stefano Iaboni: Well, if, if, if people are watching, everybody saw it, right? The crowd saw it, so

Zhou Fang: Mm-hmm.

Stefano Iaboni: it and happen, right? You know you, like you say, you're supposed to walk into the stage carrying a cup of [00:19:00] coffee, and then you drop this cup of coffee by mistake. it.

Right? Use that as your

Zhou Fang: Hmm.

Stefano Iaboni: Don't pretend it didn't happen.

Zhou Fang: Oh my God. Yeah.

Stefano Iaboni: You know what I mean? Oh gosh. Oh no. It didn't fail. Or just pretend it didn't happen. No, it did happen. That's the reality. And everybody saw it. Let's use it. Right? Let's use that mistake

Zhou Fang: that.

Stefano Iaboni: that fact that it's a mis well, a mistake.

You know what I'm trying to

Zhou Fang: Hmm

Stefano Iaboni: not a mistake, but something that wasn't supposed to happen, right?

Zhou Fang: mm-hmm. A surprise.

Stefano Iaboni: Yes. A surprise. Let's use that because. And this is in general, I think if I'm having fun doing something, everybody will with me. So

Zhou Fang: Hmm.

Stefano Iaboni: I'm doing business and then I'm enjoying what I'm doing and what I what I send out, it's happiness, joy, laughter. People would join me. You know, people

Zhou Fang: Yes.

Stefano Iaboni: It's like if I doing something, I'm struggl.

Zhou Fang: I love that.

Stefano Iaboni: as a keynote speaker or as a, you know, facilitator. If I'm doing, if I'm speaking in front of an audience and I am [00:20:00] not having fun, well, people can tell.

Zhou Fang: Mm-hmm.

Stefano Iaboni: The audience will be, will tell this person's not having fun doing his struggling is nervous.

His stress is whatever emotion they're dealing with. If I'm having fun, people will have fun with me. Well, there is always gonna be somebody in the crowd that is gonna be looking at you like judging you,

Zhou Fang: Of course.

Stefano Iaboni: Always, always

Zhou Fang: Of course.

Stefano Iaboni: in general, right?

Zhou Fang: Yeah.

Stefano Iaboni: to test you, right? Oh, show me something, or whatever.

There's always gonna be that person, whatever you do. But I think, you know, Tima is there if you enjoy what you do. Then, you know, things will go, people will follow you. Yeah.

Zhou Fang: Can I say your methodology or approach is actually a kind of, um, positive psychological psychology or like a positive enforcement? Because it reminds me of the show Ted Lasso,

Stefano Iaboni: Oh, that's great.

Zhou Fang: right? Like you take something like whatever happens out there or doing a game, it's just something that [00:21:00] happened.

Stefano Iaboni: Mm-hmm.

Zhou Fang: There's no bad or good about it, but it's about our perception, right?

Like I remember early on, wait, second season early on, this player, he accidentally kills a dog, um, playing soccer and of course football in the uk and this player before killing the dog, he, he always says Football is life, football is life. Um, and immediately after the killing of the dog by accident,

Stefano Iaboni: Yes,

Zhou Fang: right?

Accident, he says, Fu boy's death, fu boy's death, comedy, right? But like, it's about your pers perspective. And then the, um, kind of the, uh, therapist for the team comes in

Stefano Iaboni: Mm

Zhou Fang: solved it, and Ted Lasso asked him, like, the player, what happened? [00:22:00] The player says, oh, I learned that football is life and death. It's both.

Stefano Iaboni: It's both.

Zhou Fang: And I feel like that is a, like you said, it's a teaching moment, right? It's like what we can do with whatever happens out there. 'cause we can't change that. Like it's already happened,

Stefano Iaboni: I know.

Zhou Fang: but what we do with it, that's up to us.

Stefano Iaboni: Exactly. Oh, perfect. You just said that. Yeah. You nailed it. Exactly. Is that the way you react to it is the way

Zhou Fang: Yeah.

Stefano Iaboni: do out of this experience, how do you, what do you take out of this experience, right?

Zhou Fang: Mm-hmm.

Stefano Iaboni: as you said, you can't change it.

Zhou Fang: You can't change it.

Stefano Iaboni: dog died. bring it back to life.

Zhou Fang: No.

Stefano Iaboni: do I do with. Why do I, what do I, how can I use this experience, right?

Zhou Fang: Yeah.

Stefano Iaboni: for whatever. I don't know what that is, but you know, this person say, oh, football is life, and then all of a sudden football is death, but football, maybe it's both,

Zhou Fang: Yeah. Yeah, absolutely.

Stefano Iaboni: after the accident, right? [00:23:00] So

Zhou Fang: that. I love that. Uh, thank you so much. Um, this is not an ad, just so everyone knows. It is on Apple tv. You can find it te Lasso.

Stefano Iaboni: Yeah. Yes.

Zhou Fang: okay. So I want to go back to something you mentioned, uh, early on is you don't call it team building. You call it team bonding.

Stefano Iaboni: Mm

Zhou Fang: bonding for a team through laughter.

Stefano Iaboni: mm-hmm.

Zhou Fang: could you. Tell me more, like

Stefano Iaboni: Mm-hmm.

Zhou Fang: how do you do it and what do you mean by team bonding?

Stefano Iaboni: so I like the different between bonding and and building, right? Because sometimes I feel like. Team building, sometimes, not necessarily, but sometimes involves competition, involves putting two teams or two people against each other to compete. Who's the best, who's the fastest, who's the strongest, whatever that is, right? I like to do things where people collaborate. Right. Because ultimately I believe we all wanna get to the same place, right? So I had a [00:24:00] friend that, uh, that, that, you know, once told me, you know, it's like we all wanna get to the mo to the top of the mountain, right? But there are different routes, right? You have different path.

We all wanna get

Zhou Fang: Oh my gosh. Yeah.

Stefano Iaboni: we all wanna get to the top, right? But

Zhou Fang: Mm-hmm.

Stefano Iaboni: route. You can take the whiny road, you can take the steep road, you can take the slow road, you can take the rocky road. We're all gonna get there,

Zhou Fang: Mm-hmm.

Stefano Iaboni: So we have different way to do things, right? And, but I think collaboration is. It's what we have. It's what we need, especially now as human

Zhou Fang: Especially now.

Stefano Iaboni: let's help each other. Let's collaborate. Let's bring our strength together. Because I might have something that is within me, that is part of me, that is part of my culture, that is part of my bringing.

Zhou Fang: Mm-hmm.

Stefano Iaboni: That I can share with you.

Same. Look, we as you, we started this conversation, China and Italy, okay. We might have sim similarity, we might have things

Zhou Fang: We really do.

Stefano Iaboni: it together and create something together. Because I learned something from your culture and you're learning something from me, and it's not good or bad. It's not that.

It's not like. Oh, your culture is better than mine. Oh, no, I do [00:25:00] things better than yours. See, like similar. I remember when we talk about, one of the things that we talk about, you know, is food.

Zhou Fang: Yeah.

Stefano Iaboni: that both culture have this really, like, strong, don't know, you know, pink feeling about food and, and you know what I mean,

Zhou Fang: Yes,

Stefano Iaboni: right. So look like we do have similar things. We have noodles, right? The Italians have noodles. Chinese have

Zhou Fang: yes. We love our noodles.

Stefano Iaboni: So I dunno, was it the Chinese that did it first? Was it Italian? I don't

Zhou Fang: Doesn't matter.

Stefano Iaboni: it doesn't matter,

Zhou Fang: Mm-hmm.

Stefano Iaboni: we do it in a different way. But ultimately, what? It's okay, you do. You do it with like this.

I do it like that. But ultimately, what is it? We all wanna enjoy

Zhou Fang: Mm-hmm.

Stefano Iaboni: We just wanna have something that is delicious. That's ultimately, that's what it is. You

Zhou Fang: Yes.

Stefano Iaboni: in a way,

Zhou Fang: Mm-hmm.

Stefano Iaboni: a different way. I'm not saying the Chinese noodle, uh, you know, oh, my Italian noodle are better. You're Italian.

No, they, they're Chinese. No, no, no. We all wanna do it together.

Zhou Fang: Mm-hmm.

Stefano Iaboni: I try, so I, I made a very long, um, answer to your question, I think.

Zhou Fang: No, I love it.

Stefano Iaboni: But what I was trying to do say answer is like, so when I, [00:26:00] when I do training, I, I like to facilitate. Games and activities where people have to work together,

Zhou Fang: Hmm.

Stefano Iaboni: have to, we have to work together, they have to come up with ideas together. They have to collaborate, you know? And ultimately we're gonna laugh, you know? And it's, again, it's not about you. It's not, I don't tell 'em, okay, this is how you tell the joke. No, no, no, no. play a game. Okay? One of the simple, say, of the simple game that I do company sometimes is, uh, you know, I created maybe different teams, you know, and I say, okay, everybody.

Share something that you enjoy doing, you know, uh, some, some activities. And then, um, combine this within your group and come up with a, a fictional company. Okay. So maybe somebody says, oh, I really like, uh, going on hikes. Oh, great. Uh, and, uh, Stefano, what do you like? Oh, I really like, uh, eating pizza. Oh, great.

Let's combine these two ideas together and create a fictional company where you go on a hike while you're eating pizza, maybe. Okay. I don't know. Or like you

Zhou Fang: Well after.[00:27:00]

Stefano Iaboni: Or, I don't know, you make pizza while you're hiking. I don't know. And this is about, know, it's about creativity. They come and this is honestly like I seeing those people, to me, it's the greatest joy.

I, I give them, I, I say, I give you folks 10 minutes, right? Come up with a, a company. Tell me what solution you solve, what problem you solving. You know, it's fictional, you know, it's just about a game, right? But then people, uh, collaborate. Somebody has an idea and somebody has an idea. And then, and then I say, okay, I want you also like pitch it to me.

At the end of this 10 minutes, you're gonna pitch it. Okay? So you need to tell me what you're solving, what is it that you're doing? Come up with a name for your company and what is your slogan? What is your tagline? Okay.

Zhou Fang: Love.

Stefano Iaboni: it's incredible to see what people come up with, right? And this is not about, and so yes, I have different teams, maybe, right?

It depends on the size of the company. Depend on, on how many people I'm working with. But they're not competing with each other. They're just coming up with silly ideas. And then they all laugh, right? Because maybe one team is like, okay, you guys [00:28:00] presented, pitch it to me, and everybody else is listening.

Everybody's laughing at the idea because it might be ridiculous, right? Oh, Pete's on a hike. What is that? It's ridiculous. Okay. And then somebody else is like, come up with a different idea. And they, we all laughing, so you know what I mean? See what I'm trying to say. It's like we are not trying to compete and, and make my company better than the other.

No, no, no. It's about being can you just be, be okay. Be in the moment, be present. Have fun. Have fun. Okay. And this, simple game is sometimes it's something like. know, people tell you, oh wait, you know, actually we can use this in at work. We can use this in our company. Because sometimes what happen and depends on the size, right, you might have big companies that have different departments, right? And they, the, it's interesting to me, it's fascinating and that people might not do not know each other from the different department. They don't know each other. They don't know what the other person does because they work for the same company, but it's a different department. So I don't know that person.

I don't know exactly [00:29:00] what they do. Maybe in my mind, I have a picture of what they do, but I don't really. Okay, so you have a problem. Why don't you combine two departments or maybe switch the roles? Okay. I'm in one department and I switch with somebody else that is in a different department, and I, and because I have not experience in that department, I might come up with idea that the people in that same department, like never thought about it.

You know what I mean?

Zhou Fang: Totally.

Stefano Iaboni: This is like, this is creativity. Like when you step outside, you know, and you like step away from the problem you or step away from what you're dealing with, you know, you might have the moment of like, aha. Because you, you're taking your brain off that, right? And if you have somebody else like. Suggest you things right, that are not in your business. You might be surprised that they might have, you know, solution about your thing that you didn't realize because you're so stuck in the same

Zhou Fang: Mm-hmm.

Stefano Iaboni: mindset, in the same way of thinking that you can't see, uh, the other, you know, the other version.

Actually, I wanna mention something that [00:30:00] I read the other day. I read this,

Zhou Fang: Please.

Stefano Iaboni: is so cool. I love it. I read this. It says, uh, if you are, if you're inside the bottle, it's very difficult to read the label. I was like, oh, this is great. Exactly. If you're inside, you can't see when somebody else looks at you, you know, you or your company or whoever it is from the outside, they can point out

Zhou Fang: Hmm.

Stefano Iaboni: can say, Hey, you know, every time you do this, you do that, or, you know, you always talk and you always say, you know what I mean?

Zhou Fang: I agree.

Stefano Iaboni: it's like I'm, I'm helping to. a better version of yourself ultimately. Right. I'm

Zhou Fang: Yes. Yes.

Stefano Iaboni: you

Zhou Fang: Hmm.

Stefano Iaboni: out, oh, you know, maybe you wanna do this in a sort of way, hang out.

That was a very long answer.

Zhou Fang: I really appreciate that and I especially appreciate the way you, kind of, like you tell, the way you tell the difference between team building and team bonding is to turn the kind of competition to collaboration. And for me, that really [00:31:00] draws a picture. When you, when you, when you talk about. When you imagine, you know, competition is kind of like the fists against each other, right?

But if you are, um, doing collaboration, then the fists join force and going forward, right? Like we are moving forward instead of against each other.

Stefano Iaboni: Yes.

Zhou Fang: Um, so I really appreciate that, uh, explanation and I feel. I mean, I'm sure the teams you work with already are using it like team bonding instead of painting, building.

I really hope more teams out there can adapt or adopt this term, um, to kind of like. Think about what are the things we can do to genuinely bond with each other, like to see each other as a human being. Because I feel like at workplace these days, one, because oftentimes we work remotely, which is, you know, double-edged sword.

So we don't even [00:32:00] see that person. We don't see them in real life. We don't think that person as real,

Stefano Iaboni: Mm-hmm.

Zhou Fang: we treat them as less. So not intentionally, but I think because of the world we live in. And also of course, because there's a lot of like differences in kind of at workplace these days. Um, people tend not to um, just be thoughtful.

Um, but I think if we look at, you know, team activity as a bonding experiment, then perhaps we see each other more like, oh, you are a person too. I see that now.

Stefano Iaboni: Yes.

Zhou Fang: So,

Stefano Iaboni: absolutely.

Zhou Fang: yeah, I really appreciate that. And um, you also mentioned, um, I mean of course you are a creative person, otherwise you wouldn't be doing comedy and, you know, creating laughter.

Um, but when you said, you know, [00:33:00] creating these experiences is basically an exercise of creativity. Um. Can you illustrate that a little more like

Stefano Iaboni: Hmm.

Zhou Fang: how to be creative

Stefano Iaboni: Hmm.

Zhou Fang: at workplace or doing specific team bonding

Stefano Iaboni: Hmm. Yes. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Um, yeah. I think sometimes you got people

Zhou Fang: I,

Stefano Iaboni: that say, not a creative person. Or you, or you might have other people that say, oh, I'm not a funny person. I don't believe that.

Zhou Fang: huh.

Stefano Iaboni: Honestly, I don't believe that

Zhou Fang: Okay.

Stefano Iaboni: it just, that we, maybe you didn't have, uh, the opportunity or the tools to discover that

Zhou Fang: Mm-hmm.

Stefano Iaboni: have it.

Right. We all have that, you know, uh, humor, we all have creativity. Right? Um, and, and it's really like, um, yeah, some folks might need that extra boost or, or, you know, you, they might need a little push, you know, to, [00:34:00] to, you know, to bring it out, right? I, I don't know. It's just like, I mean, this game that I was sharing you with, you, it's like one, a very simple way, you know, to like

Zhou Fang: Yeah.

Stefano Iaboni: see how people can be creative, right?

Because they ultimately, what I try to do is really like. Use the things that people already have. You know,

Zhou Fang: Yeah.

Stefano Iaboni: you have it within you, right? So if I say, tell me one activities that you like. Okay, tell me when one, something that resonates with you. Tell, tell me something that moves you, that's within you.

Right? Or I could say, Hey, why don't you share, everybody, share about, um. Mm. You know, an artist that you really enjoy, you know, or a performer, an artist. It could be a musician, it could be a, a, a filmmaker. It doesn't matter. You know, just gimme a name. You know, somebody that like, oh, I really love that. I don't know Swift.

Say, okay. I dunno, I don't, but you know what I mean. Uh, somebody else like, oh, I really love, uh, uh, watching, uh, Steve Spielberg's movie. Okay.

Zhou Fang: Mm-hmm.

Stefano Iaboni: it. Okay. I, maybe we can create a story [00:35:00] that we, we have these two characters within the story or within the company.

Zhou Fang: Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm.

Stefano Iaboni: I'm really thinking something that you already have, you know, you, that's within you.

You know, I'm not making you something that is just like, oh my God, I have no idea. That might happen later in the process, you know? But I always try to start with something that it's that you, you have within you that is part of you, as part of your culture, as part of the things that you enjoy.

Zhou Fang: Mm-hmm.

Stefano Iaboni: And then, and then go from there, right? And then it's interesting because, you know, creativity, it's like a, you know. sometimes it's really like, uh, uh, you know, things about, uh, you know, if you are, say. Mm. You are a single parent and you're, you are like raising two kids, right? That you need to be creative. mean. That means being creative.

Zhou Fang: Mm-hmm.

Stefano Iaboni: It doesn't have to be, oh, I invented this time machine. Yes, cool. But not necessarily, you know what I mean? Creativity shows in many different ways, I believe. [00:36:00] Right? at work. It's, it's there. It's, it's creating that space, creating that, um, environment.

When, when I feel okay, sharing something that doesn't make sense, you know. Or know, just like, just, I don't know, like things out, like see what happens, brainstorm things, you know, just come up with whatever, mix things that don't make sense because

Zhou Fang: Hmm.

Stefano Iaboni: be surprised. They will eventually do make sense, know what I mean? Uh, yeah. Have people talk or about, you know, types of, I don't know. Um, things that they do at work, what is it that they do? What do you think this other person does at work? You know, like, oh, I never met this other person.

Zhou Fang: I see.

Stefano Iaboni: this person does? Ultimately, if there is a, if we've been working for a while and if we have this level of, uh, confidence, then I can even go like, okay, let's switch roles.

Zhou Fang: Mm

Stefano Iaboni: we switch roles? Can you be the C for a moment and you'll be [00:37:00] the employee That's, you know, that's very, oh. You know, 'cause some people feel like, oh, I don't know if I wanna be that, if I wanna play that person. You

Zhou Fang: mm.

Stefano Iaboni: You know, it helps see things that you do and helps. I don't know, it just like, um, don't know.

Or a simple things, you know, it's like, um. Hey, we have a, you have a meeting room, right? People, a lot of people in, in, you know, business, like they dread, like, they're like, I'm so scared of the meetings, you know, oh my God, another meeting. You know?

Zhou Fang: I mean.

Stefano Iaboni: Yes. You what I mean? Right. Because sometimes those meetings are like, in my opinions, like, is there really any, you know, is that really necessary?

Can we just send an email out? But, you know, maybe because of that, Hey, how about we change the name of this meeting room? Can we come up with a name, you know. of calling the media room or whatever room, or maybe we come up with a name. Let's come up with a name. Okay? What name? Everybody. Come on, brainstorm names. Gimme something. Gimme a sentence. You know the whatever name [00:38:00] for this room. You know, it's just

Zhou Fang: Make it fun. I have been to, yeah, I have been to a place, actually they did exactly that. Like instead of the meeting room or conference room, they called them like Hawthorne or, uh, like, um, what is it? Like Laurel? Like Laurel or Hawthorne, or like a mountain's name. So, so those rooms have a name? Yeah.

Stefano Iaboni: Yes, and the names can spark an emotion. You know, you read it, you feel a certain way,

Zhou Fang: Mm-hmm.

Stefano Iaboni: that that already changes.

Zhou Fang: Yeah.

Stefano Iaboni: it's not the place where I go, I have a meeting. Yes, yes, I have a meeting there. But you know what I mean? If that place has a different name, maybe it's something that is funny, you know,

Zhou Fang: Hmm.

Stefano Iaboni: will change the energy around, you know, when you start the meeting, you know?

Zhou Fang: I love that. Yeah.

Stefano Iaboni: I don't know. Hey, how about we start the meeting? Maybe we play a little of music, or maybe, how about we start with a simple question, you know, [00:39:00] start the meeting with a simple question now, such as, uh, hey, um, what is the, the weirdest thing you ever ate? I don't know. Or what is the, the, the craziest place you ever been?

Or, or what is the, oh, what if you had a superpower? What if you had a superpower and you could

Zhou Fang: Hmm.

Stefano Iaboni: a word, what would that superpower be? People are like, oh, you know, there is that mo. There's

Zhou Fang: Mm.

Stefano Iaboni: moment like, oh, I dunno, my brain is frozen. I don't know what to say. But then somebody starts, and then boom, boom, boom, boom, boom.

Things start rolling.

Zhou Fang: Mm-hmm.

Stefano Iaboni: it says it's a natural

Zhou Fang: Mm-hmm.

Stefano Iaboni: organic, you know, it's like,

Zhou Fang: I love that.

Stefano Iaboni: thing I ever ate. Oh, I once happened to be in Thailand and I ate this and that. Oh, great. And then look what somebody else says. Oh, you know, I was in Thailand too. Did you ever try that? Boom, boom, boom,

Zhou Fang: Oh yeah, totally.

Stefano Iaboni: so easy. Things happen so easy, you know what I mean? And I don't have to do anything. I just prompt a little something. I just throw a little thing, Hey,

Zhou Fang: Mm.

Stefano Iaboni: do you start with this? then yes, you're gonna

Zhou Fang: Yeah.

Stefano Iaboni: but

Zhou Fang: Yeah.

Stefano Iaboni: do you, the energy in the meaning is different. It's gonna be different [00:40:00] because you started in a different way, right?

Zhou Fang: I can feel it.

Stefano Iaboni: how you feel. The energy is moving, things are flowing. You know what I mean? Instead of

Zhou Fang: Yeah.

Stefano Iaboni: boring, boring, boring. Facts. Number, number, number. Oh gosh, this is so boring. You know what I mean?

Zhou Fang: Mm-hmm.

Stefano Iaboni: we can also talk about numbers. So I think, you know, the secret is, um, it's not about what you do, it's how you

Zhou Fang: It's how you do it. Yeah.

Stefano Iaboni: Yes.

Zhou Fang: Yeah. Yeah.

Stefano Iaboni: it's in life. Right. In general, business life, whatever that is. I think, um, a lot of things have already been created. A lot of things have already been done.

Zhou Fang: Yeah. Mm-hmm.

Stefano Iaboni: But it's the way we do it. Right. The way we present is the way I deliver is the way I do the things, right? Mm. That's different. I do it in a way.

You do it in a different way and I can't be you. You can't be me. Even if we're doing the same exact task,

Zhou Fang: Yeah.

Stefano Iaboni: doing like the way you do it,

Zhou Fang: Right.

Stefano Iaboni: I'm not you.

Zhou Fang: I also feel another aspect to your [00:41:00] work, well, I shouldn't say work. Um, what I should say to your

Stefano Iaboni: Yeah.

Zhou Fang: activities is that. For example, you mentioned role playing, right? Imagine you are the CEO. Imagine you are the manager. Imagine you are the, I don't know, hr,

Stefano Iaboni: Mm-hmm.

Zhou Fang: imagine you being them in their shoes.

Just for a moment. I feel that would give us a sense of empathy.

Stefano Iaboni: Absolutely.

Zhou Fang: I feel, you know, like of course through playfulness, right? Like what would you do if you were the CEO? Like use your imagination, like what could happen or

Stefano Iaboni: yes.

Zhou Fang: just that like, and then you'll be like, oh, it's actually not that easy. Oh, I can see, okay, that could be a problem.

Or like, yeah, it's actually a lot of responsibility. So I feel maybe by doing these activities in a fun way, it can also [00:42:00] inspire empathy in us.

Stefano Iaboni: Mm, absolutely. Empathy, and yes, and as you said, you understand. Oh, wow. Actually, I understand more about this person, what they're going through, the struggle they're facing, and actually, oh, wow, what they do. Oh, I can value what they do because now I understand it even better. I, I had, uh,

Zhou Fang: Um.

Stefano Iaboni: head that, oh, I think these people, the HR people just do this.

And then by seeing, by being them for a moment, I realized, oh, wait, they do more than that.

Zhou Fang: HR is hard. Yeah.

Stefano Iaboni: HR is hard,

Zhou Fang: Yeah.

Stefano Iaboni: Because you're like, you're everything in the company, right? You're not just like, you know, just the payroll you do, you're like the. Psychiatrist, you, you know, you do so many different

Zhou Fang: Mm-hmm.

Stefano Iaboni: Um, I, once I remember seeing this interview from a, this actor, you know, and he was sharing something, I was like, oh, yeah, I love that. He said, he, he said something like, I think that having theater in schools is so important because you, you have the [00:43:00] opportunity in being somebody else's shoes.

Zhou Fang: Hmm.

Stefano Iaboni: So you can understand, understand better what it feels like to be that person, to be that character.

Right. By role playing, you know, theater, I pretend to be this character. Right? while I am in it, I'm, I'm, I'm also understanding, oh, wait, I see things that I, I never realized that I never saw that I, because I didn't have the opportunity to be in somebody else's shoes, right? I feel like, oh, that's, I felt like that that was powerful, man.

That that was wise.

Zhou Fang: It really is.

Stefano Iaboni: we had that in schools, you know? So you, yes. And ultimately you say it's empathy, right?

Zhou Fang: Yeah.

Stefano Iaboni: see, I understand what the struggles or, you know what I mean? know, if I'm rich and I try, or can I, can I, I don't know. What is the struggle of being poor

Zhou Fang: Mm-hmm.

Stefano Iaboni: I'm poor, I don't know.

What's it like to be

Zhou Fang: Mm-hmm.

Stefano Iaboni: and see? Oh, then I, oh, that helps me

Zhou Fang: Mm-hmm.

Stefano Iaboni: Oh, I don't know.

Zhou Fang: Yeah, that's a really good, I agree as well. I [00:44:00] didn't think of it that way, you know, theater and acting. Um, but I do know, I mean, I mean, actors always say before, before they go into this. Said, sometimes they will go experience the role like in real life, like what it's like to be a real doctor, what it's like to be a nurse.

Like they go shadow or they go stay at a place for a while, say in a village just to experience before they go into acting. And I think that's like. Of course, that's like a next level, but I think that really helps a person to grow that sense of empathy and just like you said, put yourself in other people's shoes, like what it's like to be you.

You know?

Stefano Iaboni: Yes. Uh, absolutely. Yes. It's a a, a great way to, you know, understand, you know, it's a great job to understand other people roles, feelings, emotion, you know, what they go through, you know, before we judge them,

Zhou Fang: Exactly.

Stefano Iaboni: you know, before [00:45:00] we point the finger, judge them or tell 'em, oh no, why are you doing this? Wait, wait, wait, wait.

Do you understand what that person's going through? You know,

Zhou Fang: Exactly.

Stefano Iaboni: like, what's their background? I don't know, you

Zhou Fang: So we've talked a lot, we've talked a lot about your practice in bringing joy and laughter to the workplace, and I want to ask what brings you joy?

Stefano Iaboni: It brings me joy. It's, uh, oh, do what I do. I, it brings me joy to share and to teach. It brings me joy to make people laugh, entertain them, you know, because I feel like ultimately. What I do, I entertain people, you know,

Zhou Fang: Hmm

Stefano Iaboni: even if I'm, uh, speaking on stage or if I'm doing a training, it's, it's that, you know, it's that level engagement.

Zhou Fang: mm.

Stefano Iaboni: I mean, this is my, my style and this is how I like to do it, right? Maybe it's personal, right? But I like to make you feel engaged. And in order to do that, there is a level of, um, [00:46:00] entertainment.

Zhou Fang: Mm-hmm.

Stefano Iaboni: of performance or something, right? You engage, you participate, you, I don't know, you gotta do something physical, whatever that is,

Zhou Fang: Mm-hmm.

Stefano Iaboni: oh, part of this.

Zhou Fang: Mm-hmm.

Stefano Iaboni: brings me joy, is to You know, share,

Zhou Fang: Yeah.

Stefano Iaboni: What I know, I love telling stories. I like to talk. As you can tell, we've been talking. 45 minutes now. Uh, I like to tell stories. I like to talk. I like, um, like movies. I'm a big,

Zhou Fang: Me too.

Stefano Iaboni: I'm a big movie nerd. Uh, my dad was in the movie industry and

Zhou Fang: Oh, wow.

Stefano Iaboni: he's the one that sh that got me into that basic, uh,

Zhou Fang: Okay.

Stefano Iaboni: my dad was a sound guy.

He wasn't like a director, an actor, and none of that. But he was very passionate movies and he had a, you know, I still have his movie collection back in Italy, you know, which

Zhou Fang: Holy shit. Okay.

Stefano Iaboni: yeah, my wife says, oh, what are we gonna do with all those DVDs? We're gonna leave them. We can't touch them. Okay. There are thousands

Zhou Fang: Do you have a shrine for them?

Stefano Iaboni: there is a whole like hallway full of [00:47:00] DVDs and I don't even have a DVD player in the house. Funny

Zhou Fang: You need one.

Stefano Iaboni: Yes, but because that's like, that was my dad's collection, you know? And I feel like, oh, this, it's, I can't, you know, that, that, that thing is gonna, one day when I'm gone, you guys decide what to do with it, whatever.

But now that thing's gonna stay. So I love watching movies and, uh, and also, yeah, ultimately it's there, it's entertainment, it's, and it's, you know, try to. Yeah. You know, being in somebody else, place right

Zhou Fang: Mm-hmm.

Stefano Iaboni: an experience you're watching, you know,

Zhou Fang: Yeah.

Stefano Iaboni: I don't know. It's a great way to tell stories.

Zhou Fang: Yeah, I agree. I didn't know your family had a, like a, a movie entertainment background, but that makes a lot of sense. Um, I have to ask, what's the, what's one movie that you watched recently that you, you really liked?

Stefano Iaboni: Oh, I, well, a recent movie that just came out, I went and see, I saw, um, Marty Supreme.

Zhou Fang: Hmm.

Stefano Iaboni: [00:48:00] Um, I, I think a very horrible character in my opinion. Uh, this, the Marty Supreme, I mean, I don't wanna judge this person,

Zhou Fang: that the ping pong player? Okay.

Stefano Iaboni: I think the acting was amazing. The guy was his name, uh, Timothy. was great.

Zhou Fang: Mm-hmm.

Stefano Iaboni: I, I think the movie, it's funny 'cause I went with my wife, she didn't like it, you know, because also like this per this character is a humanize, uh, womanizer and a, and it is a terrible human being, in my opinion.

Zhou Fang: Mm-hmm.

Stefano Iaboni: the

Zhou Fang: Cool.

Stefano Iaboni: And then, but I also love watching, uh, I went with another friend and I watched again, uh, 12 Monkeys.

Zhou Fang: Oh, that's an older, it's an older, mm-hmm.

Stefano Iaboni: I like that. I

Zhou Fang: Yeah.

Stefano Iaboni: Terry Gilliam man

Zhou Fang: Yeah.

Stefano Iaboni: Wow. Very fascinating.

Zhou Fang: Yeah. That's a wild one. Yeah.

Stefano Iaboni: that's a wild one. Yes. And believe it or not, just the other night, um, I was like, you know what?

I wanna watch that I haven't seen in so long. wanna watch Terminator,

Zhou Fang: Really? Which one?

Stefano Iaboni: the first one

Zhou Fang: [00:49:00] Wow.

Stefano Iaboni: 1984.

Zhou Fang: Okay.

Stefano Iaboni: Great action movie.

Zhou Fang: Yeah. Entertaining.

Stefano Iaboni: very entertaining and when then that I, I look into. I, I try to find a comedy in it, and I, the comedy in the movie for me is that I, I, I saw I read this, that Arnold Schwarzenegger in the whole movie has 11 lines, a total, like less than a hundred words.

Zhou Fang: Really.

Stefano Iaboni: no movie. movie's like almost two hours long. He says less than a hundred words in the movie, but one of the thing that he says is one of the most quoted sentence in the history of movies, which is, I'll Be

Zhou Fang: I will be back. I mean,

Stefano Iaboni: Yeah.

Zhou Fang: is fan. That is fascinating.

Stefano Iaboni: To me, it's funny, right? It is

Zhou Fang: And it, that is funny. I guess I, I mean it kind of makes sense. Because the nature of the movie. But when you [00:50:00] say, you know, that's one of the most quoted lines in a less than 100 words

Stefano Iaboni: Yes,

Zhou Fang: script.

Stefano Iaboni: comical, right?

Zhou Fang: That is Yeah, it's very, it's, it's almost like ridiculous, but, but it mean, even my dad says it sometimes I'll be back.

Stefano Iaboni: Of course, right? I mean, it's, yeah. We all know that one, right?

Zhou Fang: That's wild. That's pretty funny. Okay. Um, I, I mean, I would love to have another conversation just about movie and sound and art. Um, at some point I almost feel like, why didn't we start there? Um.

Stefano Iaboni: Next time.

Zhou Fang: Next time For sure. So thank you so much for coming today, Stefano. And before we wrap up, can you tell us where to find you and how to contact you?

Stefano Iaboni: Oh yeah, you can find me on LinkedIn, well, under my name that nobody can pronounce, but Stefano Yai.

Zhou Fang: Mm-hmm.

Stefano Iaboni: so [00:51:00] S-T-E-F-A-N-O-I-A-B-O-N-I. Or you can just google me under, excuse me. Uh, www smile solution. Pacific. Well, PNW, well, Pacific Northwest, right? Smile solution pnw.com, and that's my website. You see what things that I do there or Yeah, just connect with me on LinkedIn or Smile Solution Northwest on Instagram also.

Zhou Fang: Hmm.

Stefano Iaboni: Yeah.

Zhou Fang: Got it. Cool. We'll make sure to include those in the show notes and, uh, thank you so much. We will go get food then.

Stefano Iaboni: Yes, please. I love that.

Zhou Fang: Yes.

Stefano Iaboni: a movie.

Zhou Fang: Yes. Oh yeah. That would be cool too. I mean, I have to, I have to find a super, like, outrageously ridiculous movie, like a movie that does not make any sense. That would be a good experience.

Stefano Iaboni: would be good. Yes. Um, wait,

Zhou Fang: Hmm.

Stefano Iaboni: thing, uh, what's his name?

Zhou Fang: What's his name? [00:52:00] Stephen Cho.

Stefano Iaboni: Cho? Yes. Uh, uh, great director.

Zhou Fang: Oh,

Stefano Iaboni: Right.

Zhou Fang: what's

Stefano Iaboni: right?

Zhou Fang: uh, yes. Uh, funny. He's funny. He's very funny.

Stefano Iaboni: funny. He's so funny.

Zhou Fang: Oh, he's one of the funniest people. Well. That's actually going back to your point, um, the work is serious, but we don't have to be because he's actually a very serious director.

Stefano Iaboni: You see?

Zhou Fang: Yeah,

Stefano Iaboni: is so funny,

Zhou Fang: I know that. Oh gosh, yes.

Stefano Iaboni: sense of humor. Super funny that like, because his character is so over the top right, they're just so too much, right? That

Zhou Fang: Yeah.

Stefano Iaboni: Ridiculous.

Zhou Fang: is something about his work and his. Persona that I feel is actually very profound. But he expresses his values and his world views through absurdity.

Stefano Iaboni: I love that.

Zhou Fang: Yeah, it's [00:53:00] very, yeah. That's a really good reminder. So, uh, listeners, please go check out Stephen Cho's movies. They are,

Stefano Iaboni: soccer.

Zhou Fang: yes.

Stefano Iaboni: soccer, and, uh, what's the other one? Uh, uh,

Zhou Fang: has so many.

Stefano Iaboni: No.

Zhou Fang: There is one with monkey. The monkey king.

Stefano Iaboni: Oh, the monkey king. Yes, yes,

Zhou Fang: Yeah. Those are really funny too. But the, uh, Charing Soccer. Soccer again, soccer again.

Stefano Iaboni: See? Soccer,

Zhou Fang: Wow.

Stefano Iaboni: I noticed things we have in common. Yeah.

Zhou Fang: Oh, we all love soccer. Oh gosh. Yes. But Italians and Chinese, I feel we are at different level. Like we, like. I think the thing I admire about Chinese soccer players is they keep trying, they try really hard and they're still trying, which, you know, I absolutely admire.

We love the game. We stay up to war. Watch the, uh, world Cup. Um. But wow. I, I, I love the ending of our [00:54:00] conversation. Soccer is, well, football is life.

Stefano Iaboni: Yeah. Or that, or both.

Zhou Fang: Or, or both. Or both.

Stefano Iaboni: Yeah.

Zhou Fang: Oh my God. Uh,

Stefano Iaboni: again for this opportunity. Has been wonderful.

Zhou Fang: I know. It's so fun. Thank you so much, Stefano. I'll talk to you soon.

Stefano Iaboni: All right. You take care.

Zhou Fang: I'm gonna stop recording here.