I'm here to give, not take | Jorge Gallegos and Stefanie Loebach on immigration, lgbtq+ identity, and allyship

Transcript:
00:01.45
zhoufang
Hello everyone good morning and good afternoon depending on where you are um, today's Sunday February Twelfth and a really quick note at the beginning of our programming is that our co-host Diana she's actually right now driving. Um, in Colorado probably leaving Colorado right now on her way to Virginia to be with her family for a while. Um, which also means her dog wi-fi is not here today which also means I'm here by myself along not along actually I take that back. Um. We have our guest Stephanie here as well and of course Henry is here somewhere around here playing with himself. Um, so that is just a quick programming note and today we have the pleasure. To invite my colleagues and peers and friends Stephanie and Jorge here and Jorge is joining us from Dallas Texas and today we're going to talk about um immigration and the lgptq community the history and our personal experience. Welcome. Everyone? Yeah um and we love to invite joge and stephanie to introduce ourselves Stephanie Uango sure yeah um hi I am Stephanie and um.

01:15.19
Jorge
So hello has everybody doing.

01:32.49
zhoufang
Actually this is my first time on a podcast ever. So I don't know how to quite introduce myself but be free, be free. Um yeah, my name is Stephanie and I work in um, the human resources sphere and I've been involved in a lot of dei projects within um.

01:40.30
Jorge
Um.

01:49.44
zhoufang
Ah, couple different spaces Joe and I had actually met through some volunteer work several years ago and we've had some parallel paths through diversity equity and inclusion. So I feel very honored to to be here today in that she has asked me to to speak. Um, so that's. A little bit about myself. So thank you for having me welcome. Thank you for being here and hey.

02:16.27
Jorge
I hello everyone my name is jorgegagos ah I use heat then pronouns I work doing social media marketing and I come from a background of being an influencer for several years even though. I went to school for graphastic design I'm originally from Mexico and I've been in the states for 13 years now. So it's been a full you know wry of emotions ups and downs. But. I'm so excited to be here and I'm excited to get this conversation. You know and see where it goes. Thank you so much for having me. It's also my first time doing a podcast so I'm super. Yes, your timemers.

02:59.33
zhoufang
I'll Likequi foods for the both of us then well I feel so on nerd. What an honor together. Oh I feel ownerd. Okay I'm very happy to hear that and um.

03:05.30
Jorge
Yes, thank you.

03:13.56
zhoufang
So I would like to invite maybe Stephanie to share a little bit. You know how we became interested in this topic on immigration and the connection with the algae bdq community yeah sure. Um I remember when we i. Had first started coming together on it. Um I remember it was a conversation we were having over Instagram wasn't it. Yeah yes I was sharing with you some of the old materials from school. So my background in college as I studied conflict resolution and gender studies at Portland State University and um, towards the end of my degree I was taking more classes on queer history and um also a lot of my education was on um, human trafficking and sex work and finding more. Um. Finding the I guess you say the um, the complications with the views on sex work and how human trafficking has just been handled worldwide. Um, but I along that path in one of the courses was um. Talking about ltbtq identities in um and immigration and I at the time didn't really um, know as much about um how far back these issues went and.

04:45.10
zhoufang
Ah, Joe and I had talked about that and we had um thought about doing a workshop or some sort of webinar and when this evolved into a podcast discussion I think that was sort of what we had landed on and I'm I'm happy that we get to to chat about that in a. More of a conversational sense. Um, so it's yeah, it's they had an evolution between between like now and I think we started talking about this last summer yeah yeah and last year um yeah, that's a good summary. So basically just has been a very fascinating topic and you know at times you can get really dark cause evos human trafficking and just like I don't I don't know if it's a proper word but I almost want to say ah, ah, some form of like slavery. And trapping people here. Um from different backgrounds but I also it's a very important part of our immigration history right? Like involving folks from different communities and things like that. So we become very interested and right now. Um I think. When I when we started the podcast little project Diana and I I thought I think this would actually be um, a very interesting way of um, having this conversation on immigration and the connection to al g b two l g pq community. So.

06:13.44
zhoufang
Um, so here we are today and yeah, so would like to invite Jorge to maybe just talk about your own experience. You know as an immigrant and also as a member in the al gbtq community in Modern America kind of modern United States what your experience has been.

06:35.78
Jorge
Yeah, thank you? Ah, it's been crazy. You know like when I finished university the only goal that I had in my mind was like move somewhere where I can speak english. That's the only thingme that I knew. Um. Didn't have like a proper plan of how I was going to accomplish that. But I've somehow found myself here living in the states like I said before I've been here since 2010 so going over 13 years and you know as a queer person. Growing up in a very small town in you know in Mexico it was hard for me to you know, growing up I was getting bully at school. You know like the typical story of like the macho mexican you know like attitude. You know, like bullying someone who looks different or like you know it's like I didn't even know that I was way that I was gay when people were already like you know, pointing out things at me and I was like you know I just like fashion or I just like die in my hair or things like that like I will walk down the street literally. Going from school back home and people will like yell you know like you know, omop of explorers to me so it was like very confusing but watching American Tv and all these shows with some like queer representation make me really want to.

08:05.31
Jorge
Move to this days. You know I was like I want to be in a place where I can be myself where I can feel comfortable and what I can feel safe so that was basically how you know like my mind was working at the time and for a long time that was what. You know the american dream was and then came you know some really harsh shifts. You know in the past few years and that was very difficult for me, especially because the night that Donald Trump got elected back in 2016 right? Like the first time. Um it was my it was my thirtieth birthday so I was just coming from celebrating in New York um and I was hearing I came back to Dallas we went to a gay bar.

08:44.48
zhoufang
Yep.

08:58.11
Jorge
You know like everybody has like the elections on the tv like my friends and I were like you know, having drinks. There's gogo dancers and stuff like that and we're just like hoping for the best and I think when we left the the bar there was still not concrete results. But the next morning they had announced that Trump won so you know it was kind of like shocking and I wrote about all about it in my book. So yeah, it's been it's been great but it's has his. Difficulties as well.

09:37.54
zhoufang
Yeah, thank you for sharing Jorge I think you know a couple things I heard from your talk is one is the american dream right? like I feel like as immigrants we kind of like always come with that impression. Somehow the United States is going to provide us a different version of life which is true. Um, but at the same time I guess at least for myself I didn't realize it also comes with its cost like it's not just all like. Leaders and like ringbows things like that it. It also gets really dark at times and then you mentioned the 2016 election I I remembered you very well because I didn't stay up late cause I was like.

10:20.30
Jorge
Um, yeah, yeah, yeah.

10:33.47
zhoufang
Yeah, this is like easy right? You wake up and then Hillary is gonna be a new precedent and I so I went ah when you sleep at eleven and I woke up to the news I was just like devastated. Um, so yeah, that was a very dark and scary time for sure.

10:37.56
Jorge
Yeah, yeah.

10:52.52
zhoufang
Um, so I guess I'm curious. Um about you know, maybe this is the question for both of you is um the last couple years has been pretty intense for many many communities and the the Al Gbdq Community included how has the just the overall environment. You know we for example, Stephanie and I were in Oregon so the environment is a little bit different than Texas for example and then other states as well. Um I'm curious to see you know how. How have you been involved in um, various social movements or activities over the last couple years yeah I can go first. Um, so I'm trying to think as far back as. Ah, pre pandemicdemic which is kind of far to think back on now. Um it. It all seems to just be like a fever dream. Um, but I had I think I've I volunteered um for a few organizations and then when. I was recruited with the company I'm currently at they have a dei initiative that um I felt for the first time as a queer person I could be myself and advocate for my community and um, doing that in a corporate space is pretty interesting but um.

12:24.77
zhoufang
I felt like the message was still there like I could do it from the inner workings of a company rather than I've seen like or participated in more grassroots movements I'm I'm very much a behind the scenes type of person versus being out in the crowd. Um, it maybe default to my introvert personality. But um. I think there's a lot of power with words and a lot of power um with with planning planning that. Um, so um, that's been my position at least is just trying to use the the role that I have to create change. Um, and. I think that can be really scary because yeah, although we are in the climate of or the political climate of Oregon which in Portland specifically is more liberal a little bit more lgptq friendly. It's not you know exactly the case for. Majority in the state or majority of the United States so I think we're in a pretty comfortable space um to a degree but it definitely hasn't come without its its risks. So um, yeah I think you know there's a lot of tobe continued to be had with a lot of the. Um, laws that keep passing in and out for ltp tq rights that constantly put us at risk. Yeah I definitely agree I think we we are sort of like leaving a bubble in Portland Oregon but then if you.

13:54.26
zhoufang
If we travel outside of Oregon sorry outside of Portland right? Um, you know Eastern Oregon places like that even a little bit just up north um say Washington south Washington state and I think the environment is very different. Um. So yeah, um, how about you or hey.

14:14.93
Jorge
Yeah I mean here like the climate and when it comes to all g vtq you know acceptance and you know like mobility is just like It's a lot of you know like Texas according to equality Texas last year they had 30 proposed anti lgb two ku plus laws. Um, and it was like the most in the country and. So. It's like difficult to be here. You know because you know this is my home like I have relatives here but the good thing about Texas is also like people do care about it and they do mobilize and they're always doing something. You know I go like to h or c some of their events from the federal club. So. It's always good to kind of like volunteer with them. They kind of like give you a round none of like what's happening in the legislature and. You know any time that I can use my social media to just like inform or educat my followers or just simply express that things are happening in the coning how they are affecting me as a member of the lgvt ku community and as an immigrant.

15:45.19
Jorge
So they can like put their you know like a little different perspective into their lives because like people don't realize that what their actions you know have consequences for other people you know daily like I feel like a lot of us. You know sometimes we just get so caught up in our little bubble that we forget that there's a whole world out there. Um, so you know even when I told my friends about certain things are in my immigration process they were like oh like I didn't know that and blah blah blah and it's like yeah like people just. Don't do their research. You know like people say that we're coming here and taking you know jobs. It's like if you're an illegal immigrant or you know it's not like you're going to be able to get a job. You know like you don't have the paperwork. It's like It's not like you can just walk to the fast food restaurant and be like hey and I'm here you know, just arrived from Mexico can I work. Um, so yeah, it's it's its thing kind of like I open in to see how uneducated people are in terms of like immigration and how actual.

16:45.10
zhoufang
Um, man and.

16:57.85
zhoufang
Yeah, right I think the majority of us you know in the United States we don't really I don't want to say we don't care like I think people care to a degree people care when it's convenient like I think people care.

16:58.10
Jorge
Like the system works.

17:17.60
zhoufang
When it's easy to do um and you know my personal immigration experience is similar to like it just has been very dehumanizing and 1 thing that um. I mentioned to friends I think I told you as well. Stephanie is on our paperwork. We are aliens like and like that worth along. You know, just this little detail is how they see us like.

17:48.20
Jorge
Ah.

17:52.49
zhoufang
Like why there was like choice of words right? Um, it's interesting to like looking at from so in my like role in in ah hr is doing onboarding and looking at I 9 documents and seeing the major differences between US citizens and then.

17:52.79
Jorge
Um, yeah, if. Yeah.

18:11.27
zhoufang
You know immigrants and people who are on visas and I think the extra obstacles that immigrants have to go through is really dehumanizing because it's like if you're a US citizen oh you got a passport good. Okay, great. This took 2 minutes and then it becomes a lot more complicated and.

18:22.98
Jorge
Yeah.

18:29.18
zhoufang
You know you're already like say if you're onboarding on your first day of work at a job like that's not already and you know that's that's anxiety producing.

18:34.33
Jorge
Yeah, exactly I mean for me like this whole like you know now working and everything is being like you know, like kind of like a new experience because I being here you know. Again, curious would a base ah like I overstay and you know like stop like luckily I found you know like I started dating a guy we became boyfriends. We're not married and through all of that we were able to you know like fix my situation. But. Like just imagine, not like if I have so many stars of all the things like all the leader jobs. All the things like you know that I have to do just to be able to pay my rent like you cannot get an apartment with a without. An id with a ah social security number you know like it's like you like literally I have to go on craxley is looking for people who were like sublatting who will take cash things like that I could only take you know contracting jobs that will pay either through Paypal or cash. You know, just like kind of like doing the things that I know how to do like social media graphic design and stuff like that and I actually have a very funny.

19:54.40
zhoufang
Um, okay.

20:02.54
Jorge
Kind of like crazy story about how I ended up overstaying my visa because I was going back and forth to Mexico with my you know with my you know visits partner like you come here with a tourist visa you you know like they give you a permit for six months and then I will.

20:08.62
zhoufang
Um.

20:22.14
Jorge
Go back to Mexico like stay there with my family for 3 to four weeks and then come back. Um, so the last time it was actually in 2016 and when I came like I don't know why but like I've done this before but I was just so nervous. So like when I came to the officer he lie you know when was the last time that you were here and I was like oh like I was here last year in the summer and he was like I didn't know that when you leave the country true. You know an airplane like ah. Immigration sense like well the airlines send that information to immigration. So would you know like I came last the summer before that but I left in December and I flew to Mexico so that was like the. You know miscommunication there like I should have said you know like I just absolutely here just in December I left and now coming back and it will have been fine long story short they send me to the immigration you know, like little thing in the airport and I going into the office. Ah, this officer is like you know, very aggressive like right from the get-go is like intimidating you. You know, like because they don't know anything other than you are you know, saying things that don't match what they're seen on the computer but they have like no record of you because I had no paper I had not worked.

21:53.70
zhoufang
Um, when.

21:58.70
Jorge
Anything you know I have done and everything that I could to just kind of like be under the brainer. Um, and then like the first question that he asked me is like are you an escor which I thought that it was like the most bizarre question ever. I'm like first of all, what made you think that I'm gonna go second of all if I were an escor I will not be here in this situation I will probably be you know in me canno's living my bestba life. Um, so anyway, he kept like pushing pushing and like you know until I finally said yes. You know, like ah you know I work here I'm a graphic designer I'm a blogger here is my website so I gave him that and he's like but why don't you do that in Mexico and I'm like there's just not so many opportunities there. Um. He's like well you have a tourist. He said you cannot be working in the United States and I'm like yeah I know but I'm like not physically doing any labor in the United States because everything is not mine and he was like well you're gonna get the portrait and I was like okay that's fine. You know I was just like.

23:02.34
zhoufang
I think.

23:12.49
Jorge
At this point I knew that it was like he was playing the game he was like trying to intimidate me and you know I was like you know like my parents send me money every you know every month. That's why I pay my rent I make like maybe a thousand to two thousand dollars a month with this work that I'm doing. Through my website he say okay well let me go and talk to my you know manager or whatever so he gets out of the room and he's like okay we're gonna let you in for two weeks but after that you need to go back to Mexico and you probably stay there for a few years because when you come back, you're gonna have and. You have you havet a you you haven't you're gonna have a note on your record saying that you know like you were the tank here and they're probably gonna reboke your visa so I was like okay and then. Right before I leave his office is he's like don't forget about me when you get saved us so he went from. Are you an escar to don't forget about me when you get famous. It's I mean.

24:21.12
zhoufang
What it's wow.

24:22.92
Jorge
It's crazy. So yeah, not ah no people know this story because like obviously you don't want to like I cannot share things when you are in your process and everything like this but you know it's just like people don't realize.

24:29.83
zhoufang
You know. Married.

24:42.50
Jorge
Like and you know like my and I was already waiting for there for like I was in the office for like maybe 45 minutes but I've been waiting for like another hour. So. My friends were already waiting for me. They're like worrying like thinking about like what's happening you know as soon as I left that office I saw my friend and start. Cry and I was like oh my God I Ah believe would Happen. You know I was gonna get the ported and you know I got into high gear I was like trying to get a visa um the n onecycl thing for you know ths like the I don't even remember now.

25:16.57
zhoufang
Um.

25:21.73
Jorge
But yeah, like the United States Canada and Mexico have like ah yeah, like ah just kind of like a visa agreement where if you land in one like your professional lensing one of those categories you can apply. Um.

25:25.69
zhoufang
Um, oh yes, um.

25:36.31
zhoufang
Yeah, okay.

25:40.75
Jorge
So I was like trying to make it happen in those two weeks um but yeah, obviously you didn't so I just there. But yeah, that's nice story.

25:48.10
zhoufang
Wow wow! It's a thank you for sharing because it isn't very vulnerable and to be able to disclose that and I know you are at a much better place now you know, legally financially and everything basically but I think. You know, being able to share this story actually is very courageous. Um, so thank you and I think you know the fact that they just straight up opened the whole ah intergregation with are you an askcord is just like. 1 like how dare you and like 2 you know, kind of like going back to where we were how we started. This conversation is the connection between.

26:25.69
Jorge
Yeah.

26:40.91
zhoufang
Immigration and Lgptq community and then talk about human trafficking and sex work history. So is that stereotype. They just assume you you are here for.

26:46.91
Jorge
Trafficking. Yeah.

27:00.90
zhoufang
Reasons that you know no one wants to talk about yeah and they just assume that you come here because something really dark is happening or you have to do something to support yourself. Um off the table or doing something.

27:04.59
Jorge
Um, yeah.

27:19.69
zhoufang
Um, that's the society does not accept or recognize um so I think that question alone is just extremely excuse my language like very fucked up and Racism. Of course right. And Xenophobia and as well as just dehumanizing and homophobia. Yes.

27:42.69
Jorge
And homophobia I mean you know like you like you don't even know like but now that we're talking about all these things he just makes sense why he asked me that question at at the time I was like I was like what. How can you just ask me that like that doesn't make any sense you know I'm just like flying from Mexico like I I'm just like a regular guy. No like I don't know you know like but it was just like shocking to me so that just like set. Whole you know interaction into like another level. So. But yeah, it was like very difficult like I've never shared this before for obvious reasons. But I think it's important for people to realize you know like we don't come here just. Wanting to stay here. You know like I was trying the best that I cool to kind of like obey the rules and still you know like trying to get that job and that visa but like the process is very difficult. You know it's very difficult and once you're here.

28:56.99
zhoufang
Right.

28:57.27
Jorge
You cannot leave. You're basically in a prison you know like after that incident I couldn't go back to Mexico until last year like I go and see my parents. You know throughout the whole process.

29:04.81
zhoufang
Yeah, teach my.

29:12.46
Jorge
My mom got cancer breast cancer for the second time I couldn't be there for her. My grandma who I like who basically raised me she passed away and as well as my grandpa they both passed away like months from each other like literally like a month before I got my. Drink car and I couldn't go and say goodbye to them so people don't realize the sacrifices all the hardships and all the things that we have to endure just to follow the dream to be able to be here. You know, legally and be able to contribute and like to be able to part of society because it's like we don't want to take we want to give you know like we want to make this country better. We want to make our lives sweater. We want to.

29:57.65
zhoufang
Easy.

30:06.50
Jorge
Built a community you know because we know the opportunities are here. So.

30:10.75
zhoufang
That is really beautiful I think you know that's a really good place actually for me because I had a question on mind and then Ho hey you mentioned you know we're Here. We're not here to take your shit like we are here to give like. This is our home and we're here to foster our own communities in our own World. So I'm Curious. You know I think the 3 of us we all have experience and continue to ah volunteer in our own communities. So Ah I would like to kind of ask you all to share. Maybe what kind of like volunteer experience that has given you um, fulfillment and joy. And a sense of belonging in your own communities and in your own ways if you all would like to share.

31:11.54
Jorge
I can go first um, two years ago was it two years ago three years ago I don't even remember yeah Twenty twenty right before the pandemic. Um I volunteer like I was on the volunteering committee for the creating change.

31:11.91
zhoufang
In.

31:27.57
Jorge
Conference which is part of the task force. Um, which is one of the biggest lgb two q organizations mobilizing and organizing communities. Um, in the conference. What's happening here in Dallas so true friends. Was able to be part of the volunteering committee so we were like in charge of like making sure that the task force had everything that they needed and when they came here and that was just like. Mind blowing eye opening like I've never felt such belonging before in my life and it was just like the conference what they do is like they bring all of these organizations and act to this and people who are doing actual like the real work. You know. Come and talk to you and tell you what the government is doing against trans people or how you can improve your inclusions in the workplace and things like that so being surrounded by intelligent smart weird people who were doing the work to better. The community was just like. An incredible experience and I'm actually heading to San Francisco next week to for the second time and now I'm going to be there with that gay. Yeah, we're goingnna be yes, it's goingnna be our first in-person event that we're going to be tackling.

32:53.20
zhoufang
Ah, oh.

33:02.63
Jorge
Throughout our die gate campaigns.

33:05.62
zhoufang
That's amazing. Um I yeah I mean I follow you on Instagram so I'll be sure to follow the journey. It sounds very exciting.

33:12.10
Jorge
Yeah, yeah should be fun and a lot of like you know it's smart. A lot of learning is going to happen trail that trip as well. So I'm like really excited like it was like a really good opportunity for me to realize you know like there's so much that we can do. You know because I like I use my online presence as a way to you know like share information share resources but like the work that these people are doing is like beyond like off the charge like constantly like. Twenty four seven there's not stuff because like at like late legislation and tight lg v station. It doesn't stop either. You know we see her right now like here in da here in Texas they're trying to ban you know like.

33:56.64
zhoufang
No yeah.

34:05.28
Jorge
Drag brunches and drag Queens but you can carry open a firearm and it's just like ridiculous.

34:09.20
zhoufang
Yeah. Again I think that's just very I don't know it's it's I was like I would I don't know if I will feel comfortable leaving Texas right now to be honest, like it's gosh.

34:26.62
Jorge
Yeah, Dallas is 10 god Dallas is like a very you know liberal city and everybody is mostly you know like welcoming and the l g v t q community. It's very. Ah, where of the issues. But it's also very bri very fun and you know it's like a very tight community as well.

34:55.80
zhoufang
Amazing about you I you know I'm actually I'm having some guilty feelings because I haven't volunteered outside of work for a long time but I can share. Um, so currently I'm not volunteering but I've had a lot of. Volunteering experience and 1 significant one that I can relate to this conversation is um when I volunteered for an organization that offered resources for sex workers. Um, and I would have weekly check-ins with them and offering like resources. Um, but.

35:31.22
zhoufang
You know, very similarly. It's it's difficult for someone who's involved with in sex work to find an apartment or um, give proof of income and um feel like that they can go to a doctor where it's safe for them to talk about their. Their life like because their sex life is they're you know part of their occupation and so I think it gets really complicated but um, yeah I haven't found a way yet to reconnect myself. Um, volunteering with the local community. So. And something that I've been interested in exploring later on this year but I'm not I'm not quite quite ready yet I hit I hit some serious burnout. So um, yeah. I mean I think that's totally valid right? Like we all get jaded and burnt out in life and I don't think you should feel like guilty and there's absolutely no shaming at least not intentionally. Ah.

36:27.92
Jorge
Yeah, no I I can totally relate to that, especially during the pandemic like that was so difficult for me because we had just gotten married in February like the first week and then.

36:34.87
zhoufang
Yeah.

36:47.47
Jorge
In March we were already in lockdown and then whatever happened with George Floyd the black black ma like blacks like mar movement and you know living in a you know, very expensive highrise mostly of like why cisiander people included my husband.

36:53.12
zhoufang
When.

37:03.89
zhoufang
Okay.

37:07.49
Jorge
Um, you know and it's it was hard because he could not understand how upset things were making me you know because he couldn didn't relate to my experience imneic around I'm like you know.

37:21.39
zhoufang
Easy.

37:24.34
Jorge
I know what the black community is feeling because I know what the you know hispanic community has gone true to be in this country so it's like and then the whole rhetoric about it and like Trump and like you know the rape is ah blah blah blah they're sending. You know these things and.

37:43.00
Jorge
It was just like really hard for me I had to like literally stop watching the news I had to take a break from social media like I had to delete my Facebook because people were just like sharing the most you know, clickbay information you know like this and that and that and.

37:52.62
zhoufang
Yeah.

38:02.92
Jorge
It was so like it was so hard for me not to get invested that I like just for my own mental head I had to detach and like be like okay I cannot deal with this right now you know, especially also because we were just in the process of beginning My. You know my immigration application. So like we didn't know if that was going to go true like because he was talking about you know making ah gay marriage illegal again and all these things so like going through the immigration process while all of those things were happening. Well, it's like super super hard.

38:41.31
zhoufang
Yeah, no, it's ah it's really like I can't even imagine the compound feeling of not only is your your livelihood at stake but your relationship as well as you're trying to bring your life together. There's. This legislation. That's just tearing it apart on a regular basis. It's like as Joe said it's like really fucked up.

39:01.10
Jorge
And it is yeah but you know I think we're heading into a place where things are getting better or at least people are trying and I think what we're seeing now in politics is like people showing their true colors. And now I think people can bluntly say you know like I'm going to support that or I'm going to support this and then you know you're going to start seeing Change. Hopefully you know.

39:35.24
zhoufang
Yeah I think I think I do think it's really important to stay hopeful and while you know things have been really challenging in this country. Um. But progress is being made I think so so that at least we can you know, look forward to making more positive impact in our own communities and while I listen to our talk I just feel like there. There are a lot of intersections going on like. Just in our little conversation Here. You know there is of course the immigrant community and then our gpdq movement and then comes to sex workers and other underrepresented communities and talking about. Volunteering which in itself is a complex topic as Well. You know we talk about you know, volunteering is because we care about certain. Um. Causes and we do it. But then if we overwork ourselves we get burned out and we just kind of like have to step back and I think you know another really important thing that I want you to mention is because of all the intersections and the experiences we have.

40:55.13
zhoufang
Collectively we just become so strong and resilient and I feel like you know both the Al Gptq and immigrant communities I think we are strong. You know for better or worse. Because of other shit we have to go through and then we long ah along the way we learn along the way and then we help each other and I think that's a pretty amazing thing you know, even though it all just looks so dark at times but that when we share these kind of stories.

41:29.39
Jorge
Um, and yeah.

41:32.75
zhoufang
Yeah, like you know what we're doing pretty well in the Grand stupid things. Um, so thank you all for sharing I Definitely feel very fortunate on this moment right now it's It's just like.

41:36.41
Jorge
Yes, absolutely exactly.

41:51.93
zhoufang
Everything so complicated and difficult. But then we're just here you know doing this little podcast sharing our life stories and feel safe and supported in our own ways. Um.

41:59.11
Jorge
Yeah, yeah. Yeah, and you know that should be the lesson. You know to always continue to try and to stay hopeful because you know like if you have a goal if you have a train. As long as you know for sure that that's what you want, you're going to make it Happen. You know like I knew that I wanted to be here I didn't know how was going to make it happen but you know that didn't stop me like you know, like all the hardships all the trouble all those night where I didn't know if I was goingnna be able to pay my rent. Or you know having to ask a friend if I could like go and you know eat either their place or things like that or even having to call my parents and like you know luckily they were able to support me at some times but you know like just knowing that you're going to be okay and knowing that you. Um, push through all the hardships is like what makes lives beautiful. You know because at the end of the day we are here now you got your green car last year I go to my green card less year I like I'm like.

43:06.24
zhoufang
Even.

43:12.59
Jorge
Finally working doing what I wanted to do which is like doing it legally and doing something that I love and doing something for my community and just being able to share all the knowledge and all the tools and like be able to help the spread. You know, love and Joy. So you know those are the things that. Yeah, sometimes we forget but at the end of the day. Those are the things that matter.

43:34.21
zhoufang
Um, yeah, well said um I think at this point in our conversation. It's time for us to share our own road signs. And so very briefly for our new listeners is that a road sign um is something you know if you could say everyone is a roundabout island Jorge's one Stephan is one myself is one and if we could raise. Ah, little traffic sign on our little island. What would that be this moment and so whoever wants to share first roadside as and like what to look forward to what people would understand more. Right? Like what you really like if you could shout out on the top of your lung. What would you like the world to know. Um I would love the world to know that the infrastructure really needs more change.

44:37.60
zhoufang
Because it's the it's a system right? It's the infrastructure that we have that is causing all these obstacles and and allowing people to live their lives. So um, you know when it comes to applying for a job applying for a place to live accessing, basic needs. Um I think it's just you know it. It doesn't have to be this way. And you know thinking about even the way our systems are set up to um, enroll in medical insurance and how complicated that can be if they say you're transgender or um or you don't identify within the like Cis binary.

45:14.26
Jorge
And.

45:15.81
zhoufang
Um, you still have to put male or female like that has not changed at all. So that's one of those big things that has always come up with me come up for me. Um, and you know we have a lot of really great. Um.

45:18.74
Jorge
And.

45:31.00
zhoufang
You know nonprofits that are out there in organizations and we spoke about Burnout today. Um, and I wish that people would understand like seeing further into those organizations and the work that they're doing and that it has to be from the the source itself that. You know, doing good work comes from like building it from the ground up and not just a flash of something that you would post on social media or you know you hear something devastating happen and then you put it on your stories and that's you know your contribution for the day I think it's.

46:04.45
Jorge
And then start.

46:07.30
zhoufang
A little bit like sometimes that's all that we can do and that's like you know and a whole other thing but if it's all that we do then everything remains the same and if it's all that our awareness exists then we're just still going to you know, keep seeing these people go through like continuous obstacles and. Um, devastation. Yeah, so.

46:27.55
Jorge
Just yeah, um, yeah I think for me, we'll be like people need to look outside their little circle of friends lived literally to bubble. To be able to connect with other people and like really apply that change like you're saying is like we need to be empathetic with what other people are going through and not just care for all needs for on you know, progress we are gonna be better us. Ah, whole society and community if everybody's doing better. You know and I think that's what we need to you know, like really strive for you know like love compassion self-awareness and just like wanting to do good for the. Good of everyone else. Not yeah, not just for yourself. But for everyone you know, but like it does but like they also like the other thing is like change starts with you So like what can you do in your daily life or in your community.

47:20.24
zhoufang
And for ourselves.

47:37.70
Jorge
That can maybe affect other people you know or inspire other people to do the same.

47:41.58
zhoufang
Um, yeah, well sad and ah talking about inspiring. Um I know you both Jorge you are influencer and Stephanie you have your social media as well. Would you all like to share your social so that people can find you and follow you and see how you're doing follow your journey etc for hey, please feel free to share.

48:04.80
Jorge
I get yeah absolutely everybody can find me on any social media at Manchik that's manch I c man chik you'll see me posting. From fashion to you know travel to a lot of underwear you know of um I like being at the beach or being have naked. You know it's my nature so just and just just a little warning in there. You know.

48:36.12
zhoufang
I'll do say something I do say I will be enjoying those I would share about.

48:42.78
Jorge
Okay, great. Thank it's.

48:50.81
zhoufang
I tend to keep my Instagram private so I'm a little bit more reserved but I'm I'm on Linkedin so please feel free to add me and connect I'm made much more open on Linkedin. So um, first name Stephanie last name layock and um, spelling stef. a n I e and layak l o e b a CH um hopefully we can chat there? Yeah um, I'll share both your social on our show notes for sure. Awesome and.

49:19.87
Jorge
Thank him. Okay.

49:22.55
zhoufang
That note I I don't know about you all I'm very appreciative of you. You know, sharing your knowledge and experiences and personal journey with us today and ah some of you might heard because. Henry was making noises in the background because we don't have wi-fi to keep him quiet today. So a apologizelogies for that and then not sure where Diana is right now, but she's probably still driving. Um, and ah this is our show today. Thank you all so much. And yeah, yeah, take care who here I talk to you soon. I care I'm gonna pause.

49:57.27
Jorge
Yes, thank you Thanks for having us bye.